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Thread: General Meanderings

  1. #21
    Doc
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    Mister Gizmo,

    Bless you! Image saved and being printed up as we speak. Thanks.

    Spiggan, I'm suggesting exactly what you're saying--there are indeed 12 symbols around the clock face. As you pointed out, the number of points on a symbol assigns their number: teardrop has one point = 1, moon has two points = 2, triangle has 3 points = 3, etc.

    As you know, the symbols have an orientation to them as well: up/down/left/right. I'm assigning '+' and '-' to them according to a coordinate grid: symbols that point up and symbols that point right are '+'; symbols that point down and symbols that point left are '-'. The assignment for the rectangle is based on the graphic relationship to a '+' sign and a '-' sign: the horizontal rectangle belongs with the '-' sign and the vertical rectangle belongs with the '+' sign.

    The hexagon has no orientation: it's the same if you flip it vertically, and it stays the same if you flip it horizontally.

    The symbols are arranged around a clock face in ascending, then descending order: +1, +2, +3, +4, +5, 6, -5, -4, -3, etc. The hexagon occupies both the 12:00 and 6:00 position and has a vertical line drawn between them bisecting the circle.

    This represents the native, basic configuration of the code wheel for this puzzle.

    The symbols of the code are then read accordingly. On p. 2:

    Down triangle = -3
    Vertical rectangle = +4
    Hexagon = 6
    Left moon = -2
    Down teardrop = -1

    NONE of this is new. I'm not 'reinventing the wheel' as it were.

    I'm suggesting there's a final intuitive step that will reveal the answer: THE WHEEL TURNS.

    Using the above code as an example, I think the wheel turns -3 'clicks', then it turns +4 'clicks', then it turns 6 clicks, then -2 clicks, etc. There are only four possible settings. The bisecting line formed by the two hexagons will always be vertical or horizontal, meaning the hexagons are always located at 12:00/6:00 or 3:00/9:00.

    Here's the thing: THE SYMBOLS CHANGE POLARITY WHEN THE WHEEL TURNS.

    For example, at the beginning:

    right moon = 2:00 position = '+' because it's facing 'right'
    left moon = 10:00 position = '-' because it's facing 'left'

    Now, turn the wheel one 'click' clockwise such that the 12:00 hexagon is now at the 3:00 position and the 6:00 hexagon is at the 9:00 position.

    The right moon now occupies the 5:00 position and it's now facing DOWN, so it's '-' when the wheel is in this position. The left moon has shifted from its original 10:00 position to the 1:00 position and is now facing UP, so it's now '+'.

    I'm suggesting this wheel turns and acts as a decoding mechanism. You will assign '+' and '-' to each symbol in the teardrop code in the book.

    As you can see, a string of '+' and '-' is easily converted to Morse code.

    Doc

  2. #22
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    I see what you mean! Thanks for explaining that so clearly. That's such a simple twist I think I could get my head around that. I think I see how it could work. The turning clock would be just a mechanism to assign an orientation/direction to each shape.

    I haven't read all the old BOS threads yet. I should probably read some of the old threads to see what all I missed.

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    Doc--Obviously I had not read your "N S E W and Circles" thread from last year when I wrote the above! I've been doing a little catch-up reading.

    I really like your teardrop code clock idea, I think it clicks, and also it makes a nice picture! What do you think about this line of thought: Since the teardrop symbols are not shown at all in the HCB (except for the rectangle for some reason)...maybe they are primarily the time indicators--the clock face itself--and then maybe something else gives us the number of clicks to move around our clock face in the 4 positions? Since there are only 4 possible positions, couldn't it be the 0-1-2-3-4 moon numbers that would give us those 4 settings? That would fit the old idea of the moon revolving around the earth, seen at various points in the sky different times of the day. (Of course that notion reminds me of the dandelion "clocks" in ATT that looked like moons and and the directional dandelion seeds, I guess they are in Dar too.)

    I was trying to think of how those lattitude/longitude red-hare moon strings of moon numbers (and also the ones without the red hares) could possibly work with the teardrop symbols on those same pages...Maybe these were for the most basic of the chant spell puzzles, maybe they were supposed to be the ones for the ladybug rings?

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    I forgot to add, I do totally like your whole principle of the teardrop clock symbols changing direction/polarity as they rotate around the dial, up/down, left/right, and using the "+" and "-" from them for morse code. It looks nice and simple to me.

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    Doc
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    Spiggan,

    The simplicity of it makes me think it's going to work as well. The flu season has hit really early in northern Louisiana this year, and I haven't really spent a lot of time working on it.

    I'm taking a very short weekend break to one of my favorite cities--Dallas--and I did manage to bring the book along, so I'll try to take a look and get back to you.

    Understanding the simplicity of this decoding wheel is setting us up to work on the apparent gibberish of the HBC. I'm always thinking about how the information will be utilized, but I need some solid solutions of the preliminary puzzles to gain some traction.

    The impression that I'm getting is that the three primary preliminary puzzles (try saying THAT three times really fast )--the teardrop code, the moon code, and the flip code--are providing clues to set up the three wheels to be used to decode the HBC.

    I'm also getting the impression that the names of the three classifications of spells are also hints on setting up the three wheels: 'Arise, Descend, Crevasse' are hints for one wheel, etc.

    Still turning the wheels,

    Doc

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    I forgot to add that I was thinking about the base 5 moon code on my drive to Dallas. There's an interesting anomaly that I'm going to spend some time thinking about--the symbol for '4' is an open crescent moon, and it's considerably larger than the other symbols.

    The concept of open/filled-in and large/small symbols comes into play in the larger picture, and I'm wondering if there isn't some underlying teaching mechanism in his selection of '4' being a considerably larger symbol than the others.

    Doc

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    Ahhhhh...

    There appears to be a simple logic puzzle lurking within the base 5 code.

    The symbols have attributes.

    1. A symbol is either a dot or a crescent--I really think that's going to represent being a sun or a moon.
    2. A symbol is either small or large.
    3. A symbol is either filled-in or empty.
    4. In the case of the moons, a symbol is either pointing left or right.

    Knowing a symbol's base 5 equivalent allows one to begin assigning values to the various attributes.

    Compare the symbols for '0' and '1':

    '0' = dot small empty
    '1' = dot small filled-in

    Therefore, one might assume the following:

    dot = 0
    small = 0
    empty = 0
    filled-in = 1

    You can just add the various attributes together.

    Using that knowledge, compare the symbols for '2' and '3' in the base 5 code:

    '2' = moon small filled-in right
    '3' = moon small filled-in left

    From our first example, we know that small = 0 and filled-in = 1.

    Therefore, we can now derive the following:

    moon = 1
    right = 0
    left = 1

    This is some sort of polarity thingie taking place again:

    Sun (dot) = 0/Moon (crescent) = 1
    Empty = 0/Filled-in = 1
    Right = 0/Left = 1

    The final interesting symbol from the base 5 moon code is the symbol for '4':

    '4' = Moon large empty right

    Thus far, we know that moon = 1, right = 0, empty = 0, therefore large = 3.

    Which I find very curious.

    If this base 5 code is a teaching mechanism, one can see how easily this information could be carried forward into the HBC.

    Doc

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    you might try and work the ladybugs into your mechanism, Doc.
    there is a large symmetry between these two sets of symbols.
    there's a diagram attached, the boxed items are possibly from an upside down page, but if not you have 11 varieties with a 5-5 reflection symmetry.

    http://www.geneticmoo.com/dar/ladybugs.jpg

    there are several other symbol sets which have 11 varieties with a contained 5-5 symmetry.
    finally try to connect these to the apple dials - remember the only symbols in the book which have 26 built in slots.

    good luck!

  9. #29
    Doc
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    TIM,

    I'm very happy with the way this is going. Believe it or not, I see it becoming simpler. Realizing the subtle logic puzzle hidden in the base 5 code and how it applies to the greater HCB is a Big Step.

    I appreciate the heads up on the ladybugs. I hadn't caught that before, and I'll bear that in mind. I'm thinking those 26-letter rings are hints for a higher-level ring that are connected to the colored dots at the bottom of that page. I can't know that yet, so I'm always bearing it in mind.

    The puzzle of the huge blocks of code appear to be boiling down to three simple wheels. Each circle has a big '+' in it and represents opposites in polarity.

    Draw three circles and draw big '+' signs in them. The NSEW are labelled as follows:

    1. Sun wheel
    N = Sun (circles) = negative
    S = Moon (crescents) = positive
    W = Left = positive
    E = Right = negative

    2. Moon wheel
    N = Large Symbols = positive
    S = Small Symbols = negative
    E = Filled-in Symbols = positive
    W = Empty symbols = negative

    3. Earth wheel
    N = Rectangles = positive
    S = Skinny lines = negative
    E = Vertical = positive
    W = Horizontal = negative

    As in the teardrop code, I think these wheels begin to turn, and the polarities of the various attributes can change.

    This isn't completely correct as yet, but you can see how I'm thinking.

    Doc

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    Doc, your earlier analysis above of the 0-4 base 5 numbers made sense to me, and it got me wondering about the 4 rooms in the tree on pages 48 and 65, trying to make some inferences from these 4 rooms about the base 5 number tree...The center room is the biggest room, the one with the door identical to the door at the base. The door at the beginning of the spiral staircase is zero...and you have to go through the "zero" door over and over again at the center room because as I remember it, you can access the other rooms only through the center room via the swinging rope bridges leading away from it up and down, left and right. There's one (only one) round window shown to the right of the door on center room: the number (0)1.

    Then closest to the number 1 is the room hanging on the right--room 2 (and the right-pointing moon is #2). The room hanging on the left is a little higher up the tree so the left one is room 3. (The left-pointing moon is #3). I forget which one of these is workshop and the kitchen. The last highest one at #4 is the bedroom. It's interesting, on a side note, that the word "bed" reads the same mirrored left and right, and it's the room at the beginning of the book and it's the only one featuring during day and night.

    This is all obvious simple stuff, just kind of interesting. As you can tell, I like thinking about the base 5 numbers, they're really simple.

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