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Thread: A Journey

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    Quote Originally Posted by wallyworld View Post

    able monkey

    i love
    apple
    dippers
    So I See. lol. A quick read said diapers. I'll have to be more careful

    3-year-old wakes from coma singing "Mamma Mia."
    Free is the best deal!

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    Quote Originally Posted by astreeturover View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by astreeturover View Post

    one of the main themes of the puzzle as the limitation of our (unbalanced, 1+3) 4 dimensional space-time. Whereas, the 5th represents that which is beyond.
    Quote Originally Posted by View Post

    Discover the word and write without a pen, to answer without a letter

    (Anser anser) in flight
    "In the following are presented some of those gnostic winged words attributed to Jeshu." (3.9)

    http://laurency.com/L1e/kl1_3.pdf
    But if the Gospels are fiction that are encoded gnostic beliefs, then 'Jeshu' didn't exist and the words he spoke are those of the author.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jlockest View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by astreeturover View Post

    "In the following are presented some of those gnostic “winged words” … attributed to Jeshu." (3.9)

    http://laurency.com/L1e/kl1_3.pdf
    But if the Gospels are fiction that are encoded gnostic beliefs, then 'Jeshu' didn't exist and the words he spoke are those of the author.
    I believe one of the points of this portion of Laurency’s work is that the gospels are symbolic of the Gnostic viewpoint and experience of portions of reality.

    I would need to reread, but it appears Laurency is at least implying that the life of an actual historical Jeshu, and teachings, was used as a basis to fabricate additional historical fiction to convey some of the Gnostic information. And, the words “attributed to Jeshu” seem to back this up.

    I think what you are meaning is that the Jeshu mainstream Christianity professes to believe in may not have actually done / said some of the things recorded – walk on water, change water into wine, raise the dead, etc. Please clarify if this is not correct.

    So, to avoid a “I think that Laurency said this about Jeshu saying / doing that and on and on …. “ I personally prefer to look at the ideas and symbolism presented and evaluate them on that basis.

    For example,

    The three crosses on Golgotha also stand for the three worlds. (http://laurency.com/L1e/kl1_3.pdf, p. 3.4)
    ( interesting - compare to the phrasing in the Maranatha puzzle, and the p. 27 image. And that the puzzle goes to p. 49 before “All that Was Hidden Shall be seen” compared to the three Laurency 45, 47, and 49).

    For me, though, all this (including the Maranatha story) can just turn into just another belief system (ranging from simple to complex) unless it is actionable / testable / provable. Just like any idea(s) / hypotheses / theory.

    The Maranatha challenge is to take the claims found in the Maranatha story and see if they are provable:

    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Prize View Post

    Sometimes time in the dark makes it easier to appreicate the sun. The puzzle has a several purposes. One to reveal as series of related and important secrets. Another is to do so to allow those who find them to also validate them beyond possible academic doubt. Another to make the process both objective, creative and rewarding. ....

    Answers can be wrong, you can lose, but merit is also found in how you play the game.
    Free is the best deal!

    "The Scarlet Cloud Approaches"
    "Time is of ten a one-way street"
    ..........Go 5 X 5..........

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    Laurency's words:

    3.2 The Symbolic Significance of the Gospels
    1
    The four gnostic gospels of the New Testament are altogether symbolic. Their purpose was to
    account for the five stages in the development of mans consciousness from his first aspiration to
    discipleship to his acquisition of superessential consciousness.
    2
    The gnostic author of the primitive gospel showed great ingenuity in putting certain facts of
    the life of Jeshu into this symbolic tale of the return of the son to his fathers house, the self-
    realization of man, the ascent of the monad to that higher world where it has a true home by right
    of its potential godhood.
    ......
    3.6 The Symbolic Meaning of the Christian Festivals
    1
    The Christian festivals are connected with the course of events in the Gospels and thus they,
    too, are symbols of the five stages on the disciples path from the fourth to the fifth natural
    kingdom.
    2
    This fact has never dawned on the Christians, because they base their ideas on their belief that
    the gospels describe historical events. They do not know that the life of Christos in Palestine
    during the years 10572 B.C. (according to our chronology, which is based on what is mistaken
    for the birth-year of Christos) was not as it is described in the New Testament, although he was a
    historical personage.
    3
    Advent and Christmas were symbols of the first stage in discipleship. Advent in gnostic
    symbolism meant the return of the strayed son to his fathers house, the awakening of the
    monad in its causal envelope. Christmas symbolized the birth of the Christos child in the
    individual.
    4
    Christmas does not signify the birth of any particular man. In actual fact, Jeshu was born in
    the month of March (the sun in the constellation of Pisces) in the year 105 B.C.

    ......
    The life of Jeshu is described in the esoteric gospel, and there it looks quite different from the
    New Testament version. The historical truth will not be allowed for publication as long as
    Christianity exists as a religion. And only when esoterics has been generally recognized as the
    only sensible working hypothesis (it can never be anything else), will the esoteric history of
    mankind during 18 million years be allowed for publication. Until then mankind must believe in
    lies.

    ..are altogether symbolic. If the story is symbolic - like the three little pigs or Animal Farm, then aren't the words made up to create the symbols -including the phrases attributed to Jesus? Or do you think that the words are Jesus' verbatim and the rest was made up to fit around those words?

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    Dec 25th has to do with the winter solstice.

    From Wikipedia.org

    Since 45 BCE, when the 25th was established in the Julian calendar as the winter solstice of Europe, (Latin: Bruma), the difference between the calendar year (365.2500 days) and the tropical year (365.2422 days) moved the day associated with the actual astronomical solstice forward approximately three days every four centuries until 1582 when Pope Gregory XIII changed the calendar bringing the northern winter solstice to around December 21. Yearly, in the Gregorian calendar the solstice still fluctuates slightly, but in the long term, only about one day every 3000 years.


    Lindenmi
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    know the answer. Stupid is not asking.

  6. #646
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    Quote Originally Posted by astreeturover View Post

    I would need to reread, but it appears Laurency is at least implying that the life of an actual historical Jeshu, and teachings, was used as a basis to fabricate additional historical fiction to convey some of the Gnostic information. And, the words “attributed to Jeshu” seem to back this up. I think what you are meaning is that the Jeshu mainstream Christianity professes to believe in may not have actually done / said some of the things recorded – walk on water, change water into wine, raise the dead, etc.
    Quote Originally Posted by jlockest View Post

    ..are altogether symbolic. If the story is symbolic - like the three little pigs or Animal Farm, then aren't the words made up to create the symbols -including the phrases attributed to Jesus? Or do you think that the words are Jesus' verbatim and the rest was made up to fit around those words?
    I don't know.

    Let's say 1000 years from now, someone reads the Book of Jlockest 3:23 - " Where nothing should be, everything is".

    I don't recall you ever saying that, but it doesn't prove that you didn't (don't) exist.

    I'm trying to understand the essence of your questions.

    Would the sayings / teachings (attibuted to) Jesus ("Buddhas", Lao Tsu, etc.) somehow become more believable or worth checking into if it could be proven that the individual actually existed and actually said those things?

    Or, conversely, that dishonesty about who said what taints the potential Truth of those sayings?

    One could spend a lifetime trying to prove these things, and in the end, even if proven the factuality of the source, would there be much progress in a search for Truth?

    Again, to me, the ideas are more important. So. with Maranatha, the puzzle book as written, has no author named. 1000 years from now there should be no dispute as to who said what. Just the book, its teachings.

    That seems simplest to me.

    astree
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    "The Scarlet Cloud Approaches"
    "Time is of ten a one-way street"
    ..........Go 5 X 5..........

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    Quote Originally Posted by astreeturover View Post
    [
    .....

    Let's say 1000 years from now, someone reads the Book of Jlockest 3:23 - " Where nothing should be, everything is".

    I don't recall you ever saying that, but it doesn't prove that you didn't (don't) exist.

    I'm trying to understand the essence of your questions.

    Would the sayings / teachings (attibuted to) Jesus ("Buddhas", Lao Tsu, etc.) somehow become more believable or worth checking into if it could be proven that the individual actually existed and actually said those things?

    Or, conversely, that dishonesty about who said what taints the potential Truth of those sayings?

    One could spend a lifetime trying to prove these things, and in the end, even if proven the factuality of the source, would there be much progress in a search for Truth?

    Again, to me, the ideas are more important. So. with Maranatha, the puzzle book as written, has no author named. 1000 years from now there should be no dispute as to who said what. Just the book, its teachings.

    That seems simplest to me.

    astree
    No, but if someone then says '...ah yes, that book that quoted JL - that was all totally symbolic and only written to prove that Einstein's theory of banana aging was the answer to the universe. JL did exist as a person, but not in the way portrayed in the book. He didn't even exist in the period stated and all the situations are fictitious.' Then surely you could assume that the sayings attributed to JL were also symbolically added to the situtation to convey the 'required' meaning. Maybe they only used JL as a 'hook' to hang the saying off.

    One of those futile questions again though, as according to Laurency you'll never know the truth about Jesus until Christianity is no more.
    The life of Jeshu is described in the esoteric gospel, and there it looks quite different from the
    New Testament version. The historical truth will not be allowed for publication as long as
    Christianity exists as a religion. And only when esoterics has been generally recognized as the
    only sensible working hypothesis (it can never be anything else), will the esoteric history of
    mankind during 18 million years be allowed for publication. Until then mankind must believe in
    lies.

  8. #648
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    Quote Originally Posted by jlockest View Post

    No, but if someone then says '...ah yes, that book that quoted JL - that was all totally symbolic and only written to prove that Einstein's theory of banana aging was the answer to the universe. JL did exist as a person, but not in the way portrayed in the book. He didn't even exist in the period stated and all the situations are fictitious.' Then surely you could assume that the sayings attributed to JL were also symbolically added to the situtation to convey the 'required' meaning. Maybe they only used JL as a 'hook' to hang the saying off.

    One of those futile questions again though, as according to Laurency you'll never know the truth about Jesus until Christianity is no more.
    I think I'm following your points, but I don't see what difference (for the purpose of this discussion) it makes whether Jesus (Rav Laitman, Henry Laurency ....) existed / didn't exist and / or said and did / didn't say and do what is attributed to them.

    Somebody had the words / ideas and recorded them. It is up to us, if we choose, to evaluate and test the ideas.

    So, in your example of the banana aging, it is the idea and not who said it, that is important. The idea can be tested and perhaps be proven to be factual or not, regardless of whether JL proposed it or not.

    This is ultimately the Maranatha quest. Not to spend years pursuing historical factuality about who said what, but to explore ideas (and more) and pursue them regarding their usefulness in our search for Truth.

    The life of Jeshu is described in the esoteric gospel, and there it looks quite different from the
    New Testament version. The historical truth will not be allowed for publication as long as
    Christianity exists as a religion. And only when esoterics has been generally recognized as the
    only sensible working hypothesis (it can never be anything else), will the esoteric history of
    mankind during 18 million years be allowed for publication. Until then mankind must believe in
    lies.
    Again, what's it matter? Now we have not just Jeshu, but what Laurency is saying about Jeshu to worry about.

    I am trying to address what I believe is the central issue you seem to be hammering at. Please let me know if it is off.

    astree
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    "The Scarlet Cloud Approaches"
    "Time is of ten a one-way street"
    ..........Go 5 X 5..........

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    Default Going in Circles

    Quote Originally Posted by astreeturover View Post

    We have 2 girls, 4 and 7.

    A Course In Time Travel - Excerpt 47

    "to more closely resembling the text of a number of papyri (B74 for Acts, B47 for the Apocalypse)."

    11:11
    36:63
    ====
    47:74
    .
    Jellyfish Crop Circle at Waylands Smithy, nr Kingstone Coombs, Oxfordshire. Reported 29th May. 2009
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    "The Scarlet Cloud Approaches"
    "Time is of ten a one-way street"
    ..........Go 5 X 5..........

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    Default p. 27

    Quote Originally Posted by leafandbranch View Post

    what's the point? It's time to draw a line in the sand. We have gone full circle.
    Code:
    I T ' S . T I M E
    . T O . D R A W .
    A . L I N E . I N
    . T H E . S A N D
    Dec 25 2005

    So did those feet in ancient times walk where they buried their burning gold!
    So did they lay their mantle down for a King to raise it as his standard!
    Free is the best deal!

    "The Scarlet Cloud Approaches"
    "Time is of ten a one-way street"
    ..........Go 5 X 5..........

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