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Thread: And another way to make a Code of Numbers.

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    Pine Tree is offline Junior Twelever Copper Pine Tree is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Default And another way to make a Code of Numbers.

    Dear All,

    I’ve not been having much success lately, but after noodling around with a way to fit the key letters into the 5x5 grid, I came up with the following. I began this thought process a while back, and posted the first stages on January 20th under “5x5 Images”. Please reference that posting for perhaps more detailed background.

    Also please forgive the poor table layout below. I originally wrote it all in Word, and all the tabs didn’t cut-and-paste well (or at all, really). Export it and stick the tabs in if you want it to look better.

    To summarize, observe p86 as the primary working color grid. Use p16 primarily to help define the black blocks on p86, and also as a backup for checking out colors. On p86 there are 8 colors (Green, Orange, Pink, Burgundy, Grey, Blue, Yellow, and Lavender) distributed over 17 squares. These 8 colors correspond pretty well to their partner colors on p16, within the bounds of watercolor accuracy. There are also 8 black squares on p86. When the black squares are referenced to p16, they correspond with 5 colors (Green, Orange, Yellow, Pink, and Grey). Therefore, one can look at p86 and identify 13 different color definitions for the blocks. They are:
    - Orange - 5 boxes (5, 7, 11, 13, 20)
    - Green - 3 boxes (3,6,12)
    - Pink - 2 boxes (15,21)
    - Grey - 2 boxes (22,25)
    - Yellow - 2 boxes (14,24)
    - Blue - 1 box (8)
    - Lavender - 1 box (19)
    - Burgundy - 1 box (23)
    - Black/Green - 3 boxes (1,10,16)
    - Black/Yellow - 2 boxes (4,17)
    - Black/Orange - 1 box (2)
    - Black/Pink - 1 box (9)
    - Black/Grey - 1 box (18)

    There are also 13 “glorified letters” used for things like chapter beginnings, and each (with one exception) is paired with the appearance of a creature. They are:
    Ladybug - p16 - Z
    Spider - p20 - F
    Caterpillar - p22 - D
    Dragonfly - p25 - B
    Firefly - p28 - W
    Ant - p45 - S
    Butterfly - p52 - O
    Hummingbird - p55 - T
    Grasshopper - p59 - Y
    Snail - p66 - T
    Beetle - p69 - T
    ??? - p78 - R
    Bee - p88 - I

    I wanted to match each of these 13 with one and only one of my 13 color definitions. I needed a reasonably good color match and something to differentiate 5 of the 13 as matching the black pairs. After looking at it a few different ways, I focused on the colors of the letters themselves. Additionally, I decided to use the fact that some of the creatures are drawn differently than others. For 5 of the 12, the image of the creature that corresponds to the letter is totally black, so I assumed these would work with the black pairs. Summarizing all of this makes my table look like the one below, where the all caps are the color combinations I assigned:
    Creature - Page- Letter - Color - Black? - Assignment
    Ladybug - p16 - Z - Burgundy - BURGUNDY
    Spider - p20 - F - Green - GREEN
    Caterpillar - p22 - D - Orange/Yellow- ORANGE
    Dragonfly - p25 - B - Blue - BLUE
    Firefly - p28 - W - Green - Yes - BLACK/GREEN
    Ant - p45 - S - Grey - Yes - BLACK/GREY
    Butterfly - p52 - O - White - GREY***
    Hummingbird - p55 - T - Black - Yes - BLACK/ORANGE*
    Grasshopper - p59 - Y - Lavender - LAVENDER
    Snail - p66 - T - Black - Yes - BLACK/PINK**
    Beetle - p69 - T - Pink - PINK
    ??? - p78 - R - Black/White - YELLOW****
    Bee - p88 - I - Yellow/Red - Yes - BLACK/YELLOW

    *Black/Orange because visually it looks a lot like a black letter on an orange background.
    **Black/Pink because virtually the whole page is black text on a pink background.
    ***Tough call. Grey because the letter block is a mix of black and white (which make grey).
    ****Also tough call. Not obvious, but yellow is left over, and the Flower Fairy is pointing at a yellow leaf. Maybe she’s being helpful.
    Note: Grey and Yellow could switch in the above list.

    Plug these matches into the grid positions defined way up in my very first list, and you get:
    W T F I D
    F D B T W
    D F D R T
    W I S Y D
    T O Z R O

    Replace letters with their numerical matches (A=1, B=2, etc.) and you get “Grid A”:
    23 20 6 9 4
    6 4 2 20 23
    4 6 4 18 20
    23 9 19 25 4
    20 15 26 18 15

    OK, that’s at least a code of numbers 5 to a side. If we decide that we’re after a single digit in each position (as would fit a ZIP code), then you can reduce it by addition or multiplication. Addition would turn 23 into 5 (2+3=5), while multiplication would turn 23 into 6 (2x3=6). If you get a 2-digit number this way, like 2x6=12, then repeat the process to 1x2=2.

    The addition option gives you “Grid B”:
    5 2 6 9 4
    6 4 2 2 5
    4 6 4 9 2
    5 9 1 7 4
    2 6 8 9 6

    The multiplication option gives you “Grid C”:
    6 0 6 9 4
    6 4 2 0 6
    4 6 4 8 0
    6 9 9 0 4
    0 5 2 8 5

    If you switch the Yellow and Grey assignments above, because I’m skeptical, then the alphabetic grid becomes:
    W T F I D
    F D B T W
    D F D O T
    W I S Y D
    T R Z O R

    Replace letters with their numerical matches and you get “Grid D”:
    23 20 6 9 4
    6 4 2 20 23
    4 6 4 15 20
    23 9 19 25 4
    20 18 26 15 18

    Reduce by addition to “Grid E”:
    5 2 6 9 4
    6 4 2 2 5
    4 6 4 6 2
    5 9 1 7 4
    2 9 8 6 9

    Reduce by multiplication to “Grid F”:
    6 0 6 9 4
    6 4 2 0 6
    4 6 4 5 0
    6 9 9 0 4
    0 8 2 5 8

    Alright, I have 6 “codes of numbers 5 to a side”, and I have a strong feeling that at least 5 are wrong. As folks have been pursuing the idea of ZIP codes as a part of the solution, I did searches on Grids B, C, E, and F. Each Grid has 12 5-digit strings (5 rows, 5 columns, 2 diagonals). I was really hoping that one of the 4 would come back with all 12 strings registering good ZIP codes, distributed nicely over the lower 48. Alas, this is not the case. According to the USPS website, the following are the only matches in my sets:
    Grid B:
    56452 Hackensack, MN
    62418 Brownstown, IL
    45246 Cincinnati, OH
    54476 Schofield, WI
    29424 Charleston, SC

    Grid C:
    60694 Chicago, IL
    90808 Long Beach, CA
    46045 Goldsmith, IN

    Grid E:
    56452 Hackensack, MN
    62418 Brownstown, IL
    92676 Silverado, CA
    45249 Cincinnati, OH
    54479 Spencer, WI
    29424 Charleston, SC

    Grid F:
    60694 Chicago, IL
    90505 Torrance, CA
    46048 Ingalls, IN

    Other notes:
    - The “map fragment” theory feels good to me. I think it would be entirely reasonable for MS to require us to figure out a particular ZIP code (or some other general geographic locator – I’m not hung up on ZIP codes), then research that area for public forests or parks, then figure out which trail or road may be represented by a line with a fairy pointing near it, and finally poke around in the general area of the fairy’s direction to figure out which tree. Or something like that….
    - Each creature of course appears twice. I’d bet the second location is designed to be used with the first. In other words, pages 28 and 33 “go together” somehow because the Firefly is in both. I just don’t have any idea how yet. A summary table is:
    Creature Main Second Letter
    Ladybug p16 p31 Z
    Spider p20 p21 F
    Caterpillar p22 p39 D
    Dragonfly p25 p44 B
    Firefly p28 p33 W
    Ant p45 p77 S
    Butterfly p52 p52 O
    Hummingbird p55 p41 T
    Grasshopper p59 p86 Y
    Snail p66 p66 T
    Beetle p69 p63 T
    ??? p78 ? R
    Bee p88 p37 I

    …and it all may be totally wrong…

    That’s all I’ve got, folks.

    Best wishes to Doc for progress on his directional solution -- great job and thanks for all the work you're publishing.

    Pine Tree

  2. #2
    cajuntlc is offline Junior Twelever +1 Bronze cajuntlc is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Very Impressive Pine Tree. Nice Work.

    Do you think that Page 78 could possibly be for Pook? The one you did not see.

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    KIRSTENCAM31 is offline Needs to say Hello! KIRSTENCAM31 is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Default pook

    pssst pook is on page 77 78

  4. #4
    suelough's Avatar
    suelough is offline Master Twelever TwelevePlus
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    Ok - I'm curious! Where is Pook on pages 77 and 78??

    Thanks,

    Sue
    Whatever I feel like I wanna do. Gosh!

  5. #5
    Pine Tree is offline Junior Twelever Copper Pine Tree is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Posting this here for lack of a better place.....

    Something that's been bugging me about the "code of numbers" and the various methods of solution proposed on the forums is what might be called the "singular vs. plural" question. In other words, is there one "code of numbers five to a side" or are there multiple?

    The poem says:
    "A code of numbers five to a side reveals the name where the treasures abide", so...

    A CODE...REVEALS THE NAME... is phrased to seriously point to a single code revealing a single name (whatever that means) "where the treasures (plural) abide"

    Were it meant to refer to multiple codes, like one for each token, it really should say something like "Codes of numbers five to a side reveal the names where the treasures abide"...but it doesn't.

    So, is the phrasing in the poem an indication that there is one code revealing one name, or is it just poetic license?

    I'm not sure. I know the "single" interpretation contradicts what I wrote in the long post that introduced this thread, but the same kind of phrasing is present elsewhere in the poem, as:
    - "an even code (not 'codes')...the sanctuary (not 'sanctuarys')"
    - "with name (not 'names') in hand"

    What think ye?
    Pine

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    void's Avatar
    void is offline Junior Twelever Bronze void is an unknown quantity at this point
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    That interpretation is the best one based on the wording. I have looked at it this way from the start. Keep in mind I do not have a code of numbers a name or a sanctuary yet.

    I tell ye I would not want to try to find but one.

  7. #7
    reckhardt is offline Junior Twelever Copper reckhardt is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Pine,
    I totally agree with you. By using the lines of the poem, I think we will find what object the tokens are hidden in or on. The poem never uses the words location or place. I believe all the references to knot holes refer to the ones in the book, though I'm not sure how.

    I would also like to add that the poem says a code of numbers (not letters). To me, this means that numbers must somehow be involved. Obviously, we have to convert these numbers to letters at some point to produce the name where the treasures abide.

  8. #8
    void's Avatar
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    Reckhardt, I think the knotholes are in the book too and am glad you said that. Page 16's relates to page 20-21 for sure. Well I guess nothing is for sure. But seems to anyway.

    I am in a hunt for more examples. All those trees...

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