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Thread: Missing Letter - Q??? 25 vs 26 in the 5x5

  1. #11
    calvin's Avatar
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    perchprism,

    Thanks for your explanations...they help me to keep an open mind.

    I just thought I'd share the unsuccessful results of a promising exercise. In an attempt to make headway on the page 100 mushroom puzzle, I used an online Vigenere cipher generator to encode the name "Michael Stadther" with a list of possible keywords. My hope was that one of them would have the same letter repeats as seen in the mushroom "coordinates". (For the record, it doesn't matter whether or not a Q is in the matrix...repeated letters would appear anyways).

    The words I tried were:

    Helen
    Treasure
    Pook
    Knothole
    Key
    Keyword
    Text
    Cipher
    Alphabet
    Mushroom
    Jewel
    Jewelry
    Zac
    Ana
    Yorah
    Misty
    Trove

    No dice. Any important keywords I might be missing? (I didn't try 'group', 'grotto', or 'mirror'. I'll give those a try).

    calvin

  2. #12
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    Hey Perch,

    Ah such brain stimulation! We need to move on to something less controversial like religion or politics! LOL >oh by the way....Why is "look in me , look in me" as sung by holes in trees "obviously MIRROR"? I missed something?

  3. #13
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    Calvin, try 'To Helen'.

    Huddy, you may be right, I'm thinking "mirror" is more appropriate to the spider puzzle.

    Here's another thought about the Caesar-shift: the darklings, a brand of evil fairy, are crammed together so closely in Tophet that "...whenever one them moved, it sent a ripple through all the others." This is evil, indeed, if the darklings are synonomous with the Vigenere chart letters.

  4. #14
    max10_50 is offline Getting the hang of it. Copper max10_50 is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Default NO Q's,,,,are we sure?

    I have had my book since the beginning of February and read it thoroughly while having all kinds of fun deciphering the POEM before I even knew of the websites and the fact that it had already been figured out. I'm glad I got to have some fun before the I realized the whole thing was posted online. The NO Q hypothesis had also pretty much been accepted as fact.

    I for one don't discount that, but I still tend to Question. I am an artist myself and my last commission actually involved hiding letters in the portrait of a man's wife for Valentine's. They were SHMILY (See How Much I Love You). In this case, the wife was meant to find the letters without too much of a struggle. That was part of the gift. But it got me to thinking. MS is a complicated eQuation himself. He used very deliberate and obvious methods to avoid using the letter Q. IMO there were more than plenty of opportunities to use the letter Q. By tiptoeing around it, he had to use less accurate and expedient ways to express his quizzical quandaries. Even though the story contains many queries and questions, and actions are carried out quickly and quietly; he had to go out of his way to equip us with clues without using a single Q. Obviously he did it on purpose. My point is that if it were me, I would certainly try to throw a monkey wrench into the works to throw people off track--at least for a while. I think he wants us to solve it, of course. But I think we have to consider Mike Stadther from a psychological point of view. I think he is having a ball watching us ponder his plethora of perplexing puzzles. That's what he's about. Leaving one particular letter out of ALL the puzzles just strikes me as too staged. I picture MS getting a big kick out of all of us scurrying around like so many ants (and other Forest Creatures) trying desperately to figure this out; and we should not eliminate the possibility that we are operating under a false assumption.

    I mean it was so easy, wasn't it? 26-1=25, which fits the 5x5 =25 parameter, and Q was the obvious target since it doesn't fit into the 'official story' part of the book. Now, I'm not saying that everyone is wrong, and Q should be put back in. I'm just making a case for keeping an open mind. It's too early in the game to make such a drastic assumption that would effectively throw off all our puzzle-solving efforts. I see Q's every time I close my eyes. Speaking of eyes, don't the faces in Yorah's tree look like they have Q's for eyes?? Or am I having optical delusions..........It's enough to drive one insane! Please take this post, as always, with a grain of salt; and do not think by any means that I am downing anyone else's theories. The point of this forum is to share ideas and that's all I'm trying to do. It's only the opinion of one mom who is at home all the time with a three year old. LOL Anyone have extra prozac? hehe,,,, a straight-jacket perhaps......?
    Max('s wife)

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    LanceC is offline Junior Twelever Bronze LanceC is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Another observation, related to avoiding the letter Q, is the overabundance of the letter Z. Though I don't have the patience to do a frequency analysis of the entire story, I'm positive the frequence of Z would be well above normal. The chapter with Bee speaking in "Beezzzzzz language" alone would likely throw things off.

    I've often wondered if is intentional -- to throw off frequency analysis.

  6. #16
    Gaines is offline Junior Twelever Bronze Gaines is an unknown quantity at this point
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    Calvin,
    I just cannot get over the significance of "tools". The entire list on page 48 has been intriging to me from day one. Now, how about page 71 where Ana presents Zac with a chisel and says, "I hope you can use it". Maybe this is the key to one of the ciphers.
    On another note: we are all getting a little discouraged. I myself have take a few days off from the book. It does help. I think that much progress has been made overall and we are just getting to the second layer of the puzzle in my opinion. Hope you stay with us Calvin!

  7. #17
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    Default Vigenere code

    Hi. I am convinced this is the way to solve the puzzle. My husband and I wrote out the table, but with no Q and used those missing letters from the wood block page.

    I am trying to follow the same logic and take out X next.


    Could go no where, or it could give me 5 letters by a side.....
    Hope we all find one !!!

    hunting grasshopper with ugfxj

  8. #18
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    Gaines,

    I agree with your suspicions about the "orderly array" listed on page 48. One of the oddest passages in the book. The description of the wood seems overly detailed as well.

    J

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    Perch~In the block puzzle, what did you do with the o and the z? There are three unused groups of letter blocks.

  10. #20
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    Alluriableu--OZ is interesting, isn't it? Emerald City.

    My thinking is a little far-fetched. There are several instances in the book where the Z stands for S. Looks like OZ stands for MS, his signature in the lower right hand corner. But where else does O stand for M?

    The Pickensrooter is linked to the Hummingbird in a number of ways, in pictures and text. Ana flicks the Pickensrooter out her window, and he bobs up and down, then darts off. The description of the Pickensrooter in Ye Nomenclature of Faeries spells CRUMBS as CRUMMS. It was the double M that caught my attention. So if the Pickensrooter is linked with the Hummingbird, the Double O in Pickensrooter might be linked to the Double M of Hummingbird. Then, O=M.

    There might be a key word usable in a Vigeneer cipher that would transform the O into an M and Z into an S, but in this case, I doubt it, because the same key word letter would have to match each time, and that's doubtful. Instead, there may be wholesale letter substitution going on, where the 11 letters 'outside the box' are substituted for the 26 letters of the alphabet. In this case, O may not only equal just M, but other letters too.

    That OZ=MS is, I think, highly probable, and is a cardinal clue. It may be the necessary clue to resolving the matrix. I'm working very hard on this.

    PP

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