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Thread: Last known "Rennes genre" puzzle masterpiece

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    Default more images

    Darn graphics take forever to make. I will just add a couple more starter images right now.

    The second image in my last post contained a couple of minor errors which have been corrected in the first image below. This image shows all 200 dots from the 4 sentences that form the core of the puzzle.

    The 100 labeled dots in black are the ones which were selected during the puzzles first move, shown earlier in this thread. This is the one where 4 quadrants were folded together, with the crosses in all four planes making the selections under light, 25 at a time.

    The 100 dots in red are the ones with nothing labeled. These are the ones that were not selected in the puzzles first move, although the dots remain on the board as spatial markers, as evidenced in the puzzles second move with 3 planes, also shown earlier.

    The long (X axis) line in green is the CUISSON (cooking) line described earlier. The reason for the existence and location of the green Y axis line will be explained later.

    The second image was made to print out in "landscape" mode for anyone who may wish to verify what will come later for themselves. The cross locations have a circle around them to make identification under light easier.
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    In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
    In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
    GeneSIS -- ISaIah -- Revelations +++++++++ GOD IS!
    When you reach the end of the tail lookout for the teeth of the biting head.

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    wallyworld is offline Expert Twelever Peridot wallyworld is on a distinguished road
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    Smile Wishing Well

    Its Rounded Down
    Lets See If Its Honored


    For The Whole Of Creation To See

    My Wife Thought Of this For me

    i love her very much
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    Last edited by wallyworld; 05-25-2008 at 05:21 PM. Reason: m

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    Default more valuable than gold and all the treasures

    she loves me

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    Smile Rounded Up A Little Bit

    1
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    Smile Sistem

    Share
    Your
    Surroundings
    The
    Energy
    Matters

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    Default next move part 1: Fundamental form of puzzle with it's Maranatha parallels

    The most important thing about the next move relative to the Maranatha puzzle is not the move itself, but rather what fundamental form the puzzle MUST be in for the move to be possible. Once the puzzle is put into this form it will be realized that it was always in this form from the very beginning, with the previous forms being an allusion which nevertheless allowed valid solutions to be made up to a point, beyond which solutions become impossible.

    This next move entails a double fold along the puzzles axes again, but these new axes are at a radically different angle than the vertical and horizontal axes of a simple cell type grid, and different planes in the three dimensional fold will be at different angles to each other. With simple horizontal and vertical axes it was possible for the boundaries of the grid cells to exactly line up in three dimensions, but any deviation of the axes from the perfect vertical and horizontal makes such exact overlaps impossible.

    There is only one shape, when equidistant in it‘s spacing, which allows for perfect overlaps in three dimensions at any angle (including multiple angles at the same time), and that is a circle or DOT. As the next move will cause planes to be overlapped at radically different angles, it now is clear that the true form of the puzzle is a set of equidistant dots which are labeled with letters, equal arm crosses, and punctuation marks. When the puzzle is then folded backwards onto itself (a form of reversal), the previously missing dots will perfectly join together to eclipse each other under the light in three dimensions. There is obviously a strong congruence to the primary clue from “the parchment of clues” here:
    “AS WITH ALL HISTORIC ENGIMAS, SIMPLY JOIN THE MISSING DOTS TO FIND THE REAL SECRETS..”

    With this information in hand the previous 2 forms of the puzzle can be understood in a new light. The original scribbled paper is not really a conventional note, it is a list of the dots labels, with the same number of labels in each line. The second form the puzzle took, that of a grid of cells, seemed to work only because each cell had a missing center point and the puzzles first axes were at the same angle to the sides of the cells. Yet again we have a strong parallel with Maranatha, because you start out with a messy text (the pig-pen), then realize that despite the irregular size and spacings a grid type pattern is present, and then…

    I will demonstrate the next very convincing move in the SP puzzle, with graphics, in the next part.
    In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
    In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
    GeneSIS -- ISaIah -- Revelations +++++++++ GOD IS!
    When you reach the end of the tail lookout for the teeth of the biting head.

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    Default part 2

    Earlier in this thread I demonstrated how the “DUEX FOIS RETURNA” sentence of the puzzle can be used to give a tricky “double double” solution, with the 3 planes folded under twice making the second trick double. This game can now be repeated once it is understood that the puzzle in fact has two sets of axes (which is itself yet another solution to duex fois returna). The second pair of axes means that the riddle can be satisfied yet again by a second series of new moves along these new axes. The main X axis is formed by the line formed by knights moves from the anomalous large dot at the start of the puzzle, which anagram to CUISSON (cooking), a word with a very strong correlation to the overall riddle.

    Questions like why the dots are separated by two units instead of one, why the Y axis is at it’s exact location, and why the last column of the puzzle is chopped off will be answered convincingly in part three, as they would just be a distraction right now.

    To solve this next move simply fold the planes of the second image above back onto themselves twice along the axes, exactly like the first move with it’s four planes. This time there will be dots on both sides, as shown below, so only 2 folds are required instead of 4. In each of the two images below, the first shape is the front side and the second shape is the back side.

    Each fold will have 2 planes at one angle and 2 planes at a sharply diagonal angle to the other. Part of the folded shape is made of 4 planes while part is made of 2 planes.

    Dots that represent equal armed crosses on the surface of both sides are shown with small black circles, while dots representing crosses that exactly eclipse each other beneath the surface are marked by large grey circles. The sum total of all circles from both sides of each fold is 25 both times, and of course yet again this is “the devil that popped up and tasted it 25 times”.

    Looking at the 4 planes of the 2 folds below reveals that 10 black dots have been selected, which are the type of dots which still have labels. There are 8 letters and 2 periods. The sequence is MFEGL.REE.

    So far this 64 letter poly-alphabetic cipher has had two 64 letter and one 16 letter “keyword” revealed. These are all evenly divisible into 64. After undergoing transpositions which are the most difficult part of the puzzle, the 3 keys just mentioned all have a P above an S at the end when they are divided into 2 equal grid rows. Obviously since there is no P or S in the above sequence they have to be put into order in some other way. The short length and two periods suggest a two word anagram, very possibly of length 5 and 3.

    In the first part of the original Rennes cipher, the 128 letter cipher-text had a 128 letter keyword and an additional 8 letter keyword. The 8 letter one was formed by anagramming 8 letters into two words. These two words not only correlated to each other, but also correlated with themes associated with this genre. These two words were MORT and EPEE = DEATH and SWORD.

    MFEGLREE anagrams in French to FERME and GEL. FERME is the French word meaning “solidify”, “solid”, “firm”, “to hold onto”, etc. GEL is the French word for “frost”. Frost of course is formed when water vapor solidifies into tiny ice crystals on the surface of a solid object. Definitions of frost from my dictionary are: “1a: the process of freezing, 1b: ice particles formed from a gas on a cold surface, 1c: the temperature that causes freezing“. So clearly once again we have two words which both correlate to each other and themes associated with the genre. Curiously the sub-definition of FERME is “to close or shut out“, while the sub-definition of frost is “a cold or reserved temperament“.
    Attached Images
    In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
    In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
    GeneSIS -- ISaIah -- Revelations +++++++++ GOD IS!
    When you reach the end of the tail lookout for the teeth of the biting head.

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    Default

    I forgot to mention that the trick to getting a perfect fold along an axis is to take a ruler and trace the line by pressing down hard with a pencil or pen. When this is done the paper will almost fold itself perfectly.
    In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
    In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
    GeneSIS -- ISaIah -- Revelations +++++++++ GOD IS!
    When you reach the end of the tail lookout for the teeth of the biting head.

  9. #29
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    Default part 3: miscellaneous observations and questions

    So far I have shown 3 moves involving folding in this thread. Each move can be assigned a number. The number of the first move is obviously 4, as the puzzle is divided into 4 quadrants, and then each quadrant is viewed separately. Likewise the obvious number of the second move is 3, as the puzzle is divided into 3 planes which are viewed separately. The number of the last move seems to be 2, as 2 folds are made that each have 2 sides. Hence we get the sequence 432. Because the last move had 4 total planes we might be able to squeeze a 42 interpretation out of it also.


    In the before mentioned anagram to FERME and GEL, the most logical way that the anagrams 10 characters would be “taken off the board”, given it’s odd shape, is by column, front first then back, first fold then second. I mistakenly wrote this as MFEGL.REE. It should be MFGEL.REE. which is even better, as one of the words is then already spelled out (GEL).


    One thing I would like to emphasize about this last move is that it has infinite precision. This is not possible to see at the small scale shown, with large imperfectly placed dots, cheap grid paper, etc. When I first did this around 3 years ago I tried it with engineering quality grid paper 4 times the size of regular grid paper, and drew circles around the exact points caused by the intersection of the tiny grid lines to mark locations. I then made a perfect fold by using an acrylic straight edge and pressing down with a super fine point pen. The result of this is truly amazing to see under the light. Almost microscopic points perfectly eclipse each other despite a huge scale and you can see all the grid lines crisscrossing each other at different angles.


    This puzzle is truly one of histories masterpieces for it‘s focused brilliance and logic. What I have revealed thus far of the SP puzzle is perhaps 20% of it by length and 10% by difficulty, and this despite the fact that nothing is ever added or needed beyond the 264 characters originally scribbled on a single piece of paper.



    The first question I will answer is why the dots of the puzzle are separated by 2 equal units instead of one. To begin with this can be interpreted as yet another solution of “DUEX FOIS RETURNA”, as the lines of the grid separating the dots are drawn twice per dot instead of once.

    A second reason/confirmation started to become apparent with the second move involving 3 planes folded under each other that was described earlier in this thread. After the first move removed 100 of the 200 dots there were two completely empty columns that divided the puzzle into 3 equal planes. At this early stage a person would not be expected to understand yet that there are unlabeled dots present instead of standard empty grid cells. This then requires that a line be drawn down the column in empty space by approximating the columns center-line, which simply does not sound right. With the double grid spacing however there would be a line already there going exactly down the center of the column. Indeed, this “empty column” problem doubles as the first hint of the puzzle being in labeled and unlabeled dot format as well.

    The third reason is that just as solutions were possible up to the point before the last solution with cells but require dots to be the format for the remainder of the puzzle, so to will a 2 unit spacing be required to make forward progress with the puzzle after the last move. The fourth reason is that it is required to draw the Y axis, as explained next.



    The next question I will answer is why the center point and Y axis is at its current location instead of further down the CUISSON x axis. The new x axis crosses the old x axis at the current location of the new Y axis. It crosses the old Y axis 1 unit farther down, and thus these are really the only 2 locations to choose from.

    There are four ways to confirm that the current location is the correct one. Firstly, from the current center point a line can be drawn on the 2 unit background grid which goes from exact point to exact point in a knights move pattern. Using the alternative location would either require a line to be approximated in empty space or for the dots to be separated by 4 units instead of 2. The second reason is that if you draw the inverse of the CUISSON line (starting from the lower left dot and then making knight moves to the upper right), this line will cross the original CUISSON line at the current center point. The third reason is that the solution shown in the last post would not have worked, because no dots would eclipse each other under the light.

    The final confirmation is very dramatic and definitive. If you fold the puzzle along the CUISSON line only with all the dots present, and look at it under the light, 8 dots from one side will exactly eclipse 8 dots from the other side, so that when the paper is unfolded there are 16 total dots that have been eclipsed (labels are irrelevant for this). Now if you take the unfolded paper and fold it along the Y axis at its current location, and look at it under the light again, 8 dots from one side will exactly eclipse 8 dots from the other side as before, so that when unfolded again 16 dots are selected. The clincher is that in both cases THEY ARE THE EXACT SAME 16 DOTS!


    The next question is why I chopped off the last column of the puzzle. To begin with, it could have been left on and the solution would still have worked out the same way, the column would have just been extraneous and caused the folds to look less neat. In the same fashion as before this can be taken as an indication that something is wrong, in this case that the final column should be removed. A second reason is that once the correct Y axis has been established, removing the last column makes the origin point (where the 2 axes cross) the center point of the puzzle. Another reason is that none of the 64 letters or 4 periods is in this last column, and there are more reasons as the puzzle moves forwards.

    The final reason is more subtle. The total number of dots is 200, which is an uncharacteristically metric type of number for people who follow that aspect of this genre. 10 of these dots however form the CUISSON axis and can thus be removed, and removing the last column takes away 10 more dots. Now the total number of dots is the extremely “canonical” 180 (evenly divisible by both 9 and 12). Indeed, as 180 is half a circle, this can be seen as yet another tie in to “DUEX FOIS RETURNA”. This in turn makes the sum number of dots of the two sides of each fold from the last move a nice 90 each (primes 61+29), instead of an awkward 95.
    Attached Images
    In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
    In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
    GeneSIS -- ISaIah -- Revelations +++++++++ GOD IS!
    When you reach the end of the tail lookout for the teeth of the biting head.

  10. #30
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    Default 432

    Quote Originally Posted by APPRENTICE View Post
    So far I have shown 3 moves involving folding in this thread. Each move can be assigned a number. The number of the first move is obviously 4, as the puzzle is divided into 4 quadrants, and then each quadrant is viewed separately. Likewise the obvious number of the second move is 3, as the puzzle is divided into 3 planes which are viewed separately. The number of the last move seems to be 2, as 2 folds are made that each have 2 sides. Hence we get the sequence 432.
    A simpler way of explaining this is to count how many times "the devil pops up and tastes it 25 times" in each of the three keyword folding solutions shown in this thread.

    It happens 4 times in the first solution, 3 times in the second, and 2 times in the last one. 432

    Has anyone else wondered why there are such an incredible number of similarities between Maranatha and Sot Pecheur? Admitably this is a copycat genre if there ever was one, and its a fact that there are some similarities with the first Rennes puzzle as well. But for every similarity Maranatha has with the first Rennes puzzle there are a dozen similarities with SP, and the first puzzle is a 100 times better known.


    "So from nothing is the key revealed" = remove a zero
    In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
    In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
    GeneSIS -- ISaIah -- Revelations +++++++++ GOD IS!
    When you reach the end of the tail lookout for the teeth of the biting head.

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